Ep. 5 - Talkin' with Guests Jonathan and Anna (Part 1)

The Small Group is joined by two special guests, Benjamin's older brother Jonathan and his wife Anna who open up about their experiences with marriage, parenthood, and leadership in their local church with regard primarily with the youth. Jonathan and Benjamin open up about their shared experiences growing up, while Anna discusses her introduction into the family, especially with interacting with their father. Jonathan and Anna talk about their take aways from doing their own podcast "Gather Round Table Talks" involving deep discussions on prayer. Benjamin also opens up on an experience with Lacey's father and the moment he brought up his intention to propose to Lacey. A special shoutout to our Ashburn, Virginia listeners!

Thank you for joining in Small Group, and please feel free to participate with us by sending your thoughts, questions, or ideas by commenting, messaging, or by email (goat.bear.lobster@gmail.com). You can also reach out, and find out more about us, at our website: SmallGroupPodcast.wordpress.com. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_06 0:42

Remember, kids, don't spoil a good notion. This is Small Group Podcast. I'm Benjamin Maxwell.

SPEAKER_01 0:48

I'm Lacey Maxwell.

SPEAKER_06 0:50

And we're joined tonight with two special guests. Taylor Springer are out.

SPEAKER_01 0:57

They are on a very relaxing beach vacation this weekend. Actually, no, they're hanging out with a youth group this weekend. They're on a youth retreat. There's nothing relaxing about it.

SPEAKER_06 1:09

We are praying for them continuously. But in their place, we are honored to have two special guests, Jonathan Maxwell. There is a relation. Sort of. And his wonderful, amazing, long-suffering wife, Anna Maxwell. Yeah. So uh we kind of returned the favor. The the turns have tabled tonight. You've had us on your podcast, which we'll we'll talk about a little more here in a minute. The gather around table talks, had to think about it. Everybody's got a podcast now involving a table, and I get them all jumbled up. That's right.

SPEAKER_07 2:01

Ours is red, usually.

SPEAKER_06 2:03

And uh like we'll talk about that in uh just a few moments, you know, kind of wrapping that up and and what all did you discover and take away from your podcast. But but yeah, Jonathan is my big brother. I get to try to pick on him tonight. We'll see how well that goes. But we're we're thankful and we're blessed to have you guys with us. Thanks for joining us again. We have been blown away by how fast this podcast has taken off. And I real quick want to give a shout out to all you wonderful folks in Ashburn, Virginia.

SPEAKER_08 2:33

We can't figure out Virginia.

SPEAKER_06 2:35

We have a huge following in Ashburn, Virginia. They won't love you in Somerville, Alabama, but Ashburn, Virginia, they're they're beating Somerville, Alabama, and Eva, Alabama, Louvern, Alabama. So Lacey, I don't know if we've actually mentioned it yet. Lacey's from Luvern, Alabama. I'm from I'm from Eva, Alabama, up in North Alabama. So we've got you know friends and family there. So so does Taylor and Sabrina up in Alabama, and but we live in in the Panhandle, Florida, so Panama City, Panama City Beach, those are expected markets. But no one from Virginia. And and here's the thing at from the from the very beginning, you know, we had hits, our local areas, places where we have family, but then Ashburn, Virginia started showing up. And I thought, well, Taylor's bringing to have family up there, and that they probably sent it. I talked to Taylor, Taylor's like, I didn't send it to anybody. Same with Sabrina. So whoever's up in Ashburn, Virginia.

SPEAKER_08 3:29

Maybe you go to church with somebody that's got family up there. Maybe take the bad advice of listening to your podcast.

SPEAKER_06 3:37

Well, we're all over the place. California, Iowa, all you people that are jumping in and listening, especially continuously, we're we're so thankful to have you, and we'd love to hear from you. And one more surpriser, Vietnam. Multiple places in Vietnam we've reached, haven't figured that one out yet.

SPEAKER_01 3:53

It's lovely.

SPEAKER_06 3:55

Let us know. We're so thankful to have you. Uh we're blown away by that. But anyway, to get back to my brother, Jonathan, his wife Anna. Did you want to uh to bring them in on your icebreakers? She she'll go rogue on these icebreakers now.

SPEAKER_04 4:12

Oh no.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

So hi y'all. We are so thankful to have y'all. And first off, I just want to thank y'all, not just for being here, but for just being so amazing. Thank y'all for being the guinea pigs with having kids first. So y'all y'all y'all are not printing experts.

SPEAKER_06 4:31

I was thinking because you're the first guest. That too. First official guests.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

That too. But I have literally called Anna at 1 a.m. asking, what do I do? My child is sick. What do I do? And I just I cannot tell y'all enough how much. Just we love y'all and we appreciate y'all. We don't mind at all.

SPEAKER_08 4:54

Jamma lives for that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_06 4:56

I call Jonathan at 2 a.m. I made a I made a big mistake like he's mad at me.

SPEAKER_08 5:00

What am I doing? You go back to bed and we worry about it at 7 a.m.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

No.

SPEAKER_08 5:09

Yeah, that's what I'm supposed to say.

SPEAKER_06 5:12

He's always giving me great advice, but now Anna brings up a good question. I don't know if it's good advice at all. You should definitely question that.

SPEAKER_01 5:18

But first, just a little fun icebreaker question. If you go to a coffee shop, what is your go-to order? Like if you go to Starbucks or to a local coffee shop.

SPEAKER_08 5:32

Here's the thing. Here's the thing. Very rarely does she go on her own. So I'll I'll say, hey, coffee shop. Yeah. There's a coffee shop, you know, so and so over here, wherever she said, Well, if you're going, get me some. And it's like, okay, what do you want? I don't know, you know me.

SPEAKER_00 5:53

It's like, okay.

SPEAKER_08 5:54

And I do. Like caramel? I do. And I take caramel. The number one things I go after when I'm hunting Miss Anna some coffee. Salted caramel could never go wrong. The whole salted caramel prey, she loves that part. Anything caramel, anything and then chocolate. You know. Now if she's like, go find me some coffee, chocolate. Definitely chocolate. Now she says it's more sweetly, salted caramel.

SPEAKER_02 6:22

Salted caramel would always win.

SPEAKER_08 6:26

Chocolate is always a good idea. Chocolate's never a loser.

SPEAKER_02 6:30

Right, right.

SPEAKER_08 6:31

But I don't know what if you didn't send me after it, what would you order? I want to know.

SPEAKER_02 6:36

I would look for ice, probably, unless it was really cold.

SPEAKER_08 6:40

And something that said caramel, and I would just it takes a lot of cold for her to go over to the hot side too.

SPEAKER_01 6:45

So what about you, Jonathan?

unknown 6:49

Wow.

SPEAKER_08 6:49

I always want to try the new thing on the menu. So it's usually usually if especially if it's like a if it's like a local. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_06 7:01

I didn't realize how much you move your head when you talk.

SPEAKER_08 7:03

I'm all over the place. I'm holding on to my hands right now so I don't talk with my hands.

SPEAKER_02 7:10

You had one one time with that cayenne pepper in it.

SPEAKER_08 7:12

Yeah, no, that was actually pretty good.

SPEAKER_06 7:14

So with your hands just keep your head still.

SPEAKER_08 7:18

Hey, no, you'll get a kick. So when I had to do that that Bible lesson the other night, uh it there's video. I don't know if you saw it or if you had to see it or not. My I went back and I looked at it briefly because I don't want to watch myself. I don't like to listen to myself or nothing, see myself. YouTube? Yeah. So I went back and I my hands are all over the place. I'm like, man, bring it in, big and come on, man. But no, yes, I had one that had like chili cayenne pepper in it one time, and that sounded terrible. It was Mexican chocolate, Aztec chocolate is what it was called. And it had like cocoa powder and cayenne pepper in it, and that does not sound like it would work, and it worked very well. It does work, it was good.

SPEAKER_02 8:01

It was different.

SPEAKER_08 8:02

When we went to when I I just got back from San Diego a couple weeks ago.

SPEAKER_06 8:06

That's probably who was listening to us out in San Diego.

SPEAKER_08 8:08

It could be, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 8:09

Yeah, it might have been. I might have checked.

SPEAKER_08 8:10

We did, we got a hit in San Diego. It might have been. I might have been checking that in the hotel room.

SPEAKER_06 8:14

But false alarm, I take back that.

SPEAKER_08 8:18

There was, you know, we hit every Starbucks available to stay awake, and then there was a couple of local coffee shops, and one had this like it's called Golden State Latte. And it had like honey in it, and which is kind of weird for coffee. But again, I want to try the weird ones, you know, just to say I tried them.

SPEAKER_06 8:38

So any any lobster coffee.

SPEAKER_04 8:42

Actually, no.

SPEAKER_06 8:43

So, real quick before we we jump on in, uh Lacey didn't drink coffee before we got married. Really? This is one of the big one of the bigger you're like one you didn't either.

SPEAKER_08 8:55

Didn't either. No, you didn't either. I know you didn't know. Oh, that's right.

SPEAKER_06 8:57

Uh I mean I like I know, but uh that's crazy.

SPEAKER_08 9:00

Anna didn't really get into heavy coffee use till really not all that long ago.

SPEAKER_02 9:06

This is That was after we got married.

SPEAKER_08 9:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 9:08

That's our biggest, our big influence is on our wife. Staffing dependency. I the because she has a lot more good stuff that hopefully rubs off on me. I'm scared that I rub off on her, but that's one thing I take pride in because on our honeymoon, she she hates the she kicks herself over this because we went on our honeymoon, went to Costa Rica and did a coffee tour. That was mainly for me. Oh man. Great coffee everywhere, but she was like, she she hadn't really got to be.

SPEAKER_01 9:38

And now now that I do drink coffee, and I I drink black coffee, like I don't take any cream or anything with it. And so, but now that I love coffee, I'm like, can we please go back to Costa Rica and go on that coffee tour?

SPEAKER_08 9:50

Could Rika's what got you hooked. So that makes their coffee was good.

SPEAKER_01 9:54

I I will tell you the best coffee that we've had was when we went to Greece.

SPEAKER_08 9:58

Really?

SPEAKER_01 9:59

Yes, the coffee was like so thick you could chew it, but it is like I was bouncing.

SPEAKER_06 10:05

Comes in these little copper coffee. Oh, I've seen that method, but I've never had it. I forget what it's called. Really thick. Yeah, she's not kidding around when you chew it.

SPEAKER_01 10:14

But man, it is so it's so good.

SPEAKER_08 10:17

Some of the best coffee, some of the best coffee, ground whole bean coffee I've had is from Costa Rica. So I could see why that would start a problem.

SPEAKER_01 10:27

Um, all right. So, okay, so let's just dive into this favorite.

SPEAKER_03 10:38

I got scared for a minute. One more for J Mac.

SPEAKER_00 10:41

No.

SPEAKER_03 10:46

Why did he just hit the dirt when the sirens went on? I'm gonna see a four-wheel drive truck coming through the yard.

SPEAKER_01 10:52

All right, what is your favorite scripture?

SPEAKER_00 10:56

Can you go first, please?

SPEAKER_08 10:58

It's up to you. She she told me, she told me, she said, let me see what you wrote down so that way I don't copy it. I said, nope, nope. Wait and see. I think I know. Because I unless it's changed, I've got them in my life. Yeah, you've got it. You you cheated. I cheated. You mentioned in a previous episode that this Bible that y'all had from y'all's wedding where we all went through and marked.

SPEAKER_06 11:18

I think uh Joshua, or is it changed?

SPEAKER_02 11:22

It's I I've chosen a different one.

SPEAKER_06 11:23

I gotta I gotta update my Bible now.

SPEAKER_08 11:25

It's funny how it changes with life experiences, right? Yeah, because that's kind of what I'm you you go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 11:31

Um I chose Romans 8 26.

SPEAKER_08 11:33

Oh, close.

SPEAKER_02 11:34

Likewise, the Spirit helps us in our weakness, for we do not know what to pray for as we ought. But the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words.

SPEAKER_06 11:44

She's knocking on Lacey territory there.

SPEAKER_02 11:46

I love that. And what what you own. I just love that when you can't put into words what you want to pray, that he he knows what you need. Yes, he does for you. So yes.

SPEAKER_01 12:02

Some of my most honest prayers are, God, I got nothing. Like, I mean, you know, so many times when we pray, we're like, okay, this is how you need to fix it. Let me tell you how to do it. But but sometimes it's like, I I got nothing. I don't know how to fix it. I'm just here you go. And so I I'm very thankful for that verse as well. Thankful that the Holy Spirit intercedes on our behalf.

SPEAKER_06 12:27

So I'm looking through my Bible. I can't give you 26. I can give you verse 27 if you want that one.

SPEAKER_02 12:32

It's a book already.

SPEAKER_06 12:35

You got the whole Bible to read through. You had to pick.

SPEAKER_02 12:38

Well, there's so many.

SPEAKER_01 12:40

I'm kidding. 26 is yours, so all right. Jonathan?

SPEAKER_08 12:46

Okay, so if you were to cheat from your Bible there, you would get it right. But I'm uh it's Psalm 127. The whole thing.

SPEAKER_06 12:56

So I don't know if I had the whole thing. I think I wrote down the whole thing. It's the verse with the quivers. The arrows and the quivers. That's all.

SPEAKER_08 13:05

See, listen, this this this all of this here, all of this here is, you know, this is sturdy foundation for your life. So unless the Lord builds the house, those who build it labor in vain. Unless the Lord watches over the city, the watchman stays awake in vain. It is in vain that you rise up early and go late to rest, eating the bread of anxious toll, for he gives to his beloved sleep. Behold, children are a heritage from the Lord. The fruit of the womb will reward like arrows in the hand of a warrior are the children of one's youth. Blessed is the man who fills his quiver with them. He shall not be put to shame when he speaks with his enemy at the gate. And every time I read of that and think of that, you know, you can't help but think of the responsibility you have of raising your children and making sure they're on the right path and sharpened and ready to fly. And then another part of me, a comical part of me, thinks how much fun it would be to launch Jude. I mean, I love him, but you know, it's Jude.

SPEAKER_06 14:15

Real quick, let's go ahead and bring that in. Because I would struggle with this, assuming knowledge. I've known you what, my whole life now. Your whole life. And uh that'd be weird if we've introduced it introduced you and Anna, but a little bit about you guys. Do you have many ki many arrows in your quiver?

SPEAKER_08 14:35

Some broadheads, some not so broad heads.

SPEAKER_06 14:39

So we got Lorela, Lizzie, Lucy, and Jude. And then and Jesse.

SPEAKER_08 14:45

Yeah, Jesse was our oldest boy. And that that is one of the fires that our relationship was forged in. Jesse was our first child. And we uh had him after only being married about a year, I guess it was and then we unfortunately uh only had him for about two days on earth here and he passed, and then we learned a lot from that. We learned a lot about ourselves, we learned more about each other, I think, than anything else. But mostly we learned about the gift that we have in having a not just a tight supportive family, because we knew that we had that the whole time in that whole event, but our church family and the strength uh even to this day that's been even been turning 17 this year. No, eighteen. He'd be turning eighteen this year in June. Wow, can you imagine that? That's crazy, isn't it?

SPEAKER_06 15:58

He's made such an impact, I know, like you're talking about on you too, especially obviously. Um and and of course our our families, but also and we've talked about it on your uh podcast, so I won't get too too deep into it, but it's done a lot for us as well. It's it's been his legacy has been such a a big blessing and and strength for for many other people, us included. And but yeah, have to have to mention Jesse. And uh yeah.

SPEAKER_08 16:25

Yeah, because he's a I mean I was I was a stupid kid when we had him, you know. Still a stupid kid. I really am actually. But you know, they can come after me. I'm a man, I'm four. But yeah, it it wow, it it changes you real quick. I think it changed me for the better because it made me realize a lot of things that humbled me real quick. Which actually leads into and I was gonna say this that Psalm 127, but as of late, I've been toting around this one here. You know, and the podcast just got weird. James chapter 4, verses 13 through 15.

SPEAKER_06 17:16

I've literally been wearing that one all my in that verse yesterday before y'all got here.

SPEAKER_08 17:20

Oh, that that's why you like that patch, huh?

SPEAKER_06 17:23

I like it. James 4, 13 through 15, in case y'all can't see it.

SPEAKER_08 17:28

Yeah, James 4, 13 through 15, for everyone listening and not looking, which would be everyone except rest of the table right now. Come now, you who say today or tomorrow we will go into such and such town and spend a year there and trade and make profits. Yet you do not know what tomorrow will bring. What is your life? For you are a mist that appears for a little time and then vanishes. Instead, you ought to say, if the Lord wills, you will live and do this or that. And it's funny how that kind of, you know, like I was saying, the life experiences kind of change what your favorite verse was, like Anna's did and all that. But Psalm 120, uh it was hard for me to choose because Psalm 127 is really kind of what I live by there. Yeah. And then, you know, here as of late, it's like, you know, it's I can have all the plans I want, but it's up to what the Lord wills.

SPEAKER_06 18:23

I'm with you. My favorites for the longest time has been, yeah, you know, I know whom I have believed and persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed. I've held on to that one for so long, it's so hard to let go of it, even though I've got all these other ones now. You almost feel you almost feel like you're you're being unfaithful.

SPEAKER_04 18:39

Yeah, or you're talking to your bird. I've already committed to this one, I've got to stay with it.

SPEAKER_06 18:43

But and thank you guys. Thank you for sharing, opening up on that. Do you have uh let's hit these two real quick, some softballs? Favorite Bible story and or favorite hymn. I'm I'm I'd like I'm interested to hear this one. Hymn, especially.

SPEAKER_08 19:00

Favorite. What's your favorite Bible story? You can go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 19:03

Favorite Bible story is Hannah.

unknown 19:06

Copycat.

SPEAKER_06 19:07

Sorry, that one's been that one's been taken. Please choose another.

SPEAKER_01 19:11

Please try again.

SPEAKER_06 19:12

No, but I wouldn't have chosen wisely.

SPEAKER_01 19:17

I want to know why. I guess I feel because her name is so close to Anna.

SPEAKER_06 19:23

Hannah is Jewish for Anna. Hannah is Hebrew. Hannah is Hebrew for Anna. Y'all gotta let me finish before I get in trouble.

SPEAKER_02 19:36

I guess, you know, like obviously my story was not just like hers, but I guess I felt like it was relatable. Oh, but you know, she struggled to have a baby where we sh we lost our first and then we had that struggle. So I just felt, I guess, like I really related to her.

SPEAKER_04 20:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 20:01

Sorry for that really touching and daring moment that you just had. And uh we just choked on coffee through the whole thing.

SPEAKER_01 20:09

So Alright, Jonathan, favorite story.

SPEAKER_08 20:12

Yeah, I mean, it it's funny how much our lives revolve around that initial incident in our lives, but the story in 1 Samuel 12, 21 through 23, where David had already messed up big, and him and Bathsheba were waiting on this child to be born, the child was born, the child died. That was read at the funeral, and uh Tom actually Larkin, Tom Larkin read that preacher. Yeah, and that that stuck with me to this day, and it ends there basically ends with his servants questioning you know why he was acting the way he was and always thought that was kind of odd himself too, until going through that, and then Okay, so 2 Samuel 12, 21 through 23. Then his servants said to him, What is this thing that you have done? You fasted and wept for the child while he was alive, but when the child died, you arose and ate food. He said, While the child was still alive, I fasted and wept, for I said, Who knows whether the Lord will be gracious to me that the child may live? But now he is dead, why should I fast? Can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he will not return to me. And and Tom had inside knowledge on that 'cause he was checking on me and all that, and everybody was. You know, I didn't go unattended for nothing, even though Anna was stuck in the hospital and Jesse was stuck in the other hospital. I didn't eat. The whole time. I I didn't eat. And Tom mentioned that and read this and I was like Was that an intentional thing? No. No. Well, I mean fasting or I wasn't fasting for that reason. I just was so worried because I was 21 years old. And my my newly my still newly lived wed wife was in the hospital. My new son was in the other hospital. I couldn't be in two places at once. She couldn't be with him. And it was just so much. That it wasn't an intentional fasting, it just happened. Uh and no one could get me to eat and I would not eat.

SPEAKER_06 22:46

I know a little bit what you're uh as far as the fat the not-eating thing, when our grandfather we're getting we're gonna start getting.

SPEAKER_08 22:54

I'm sorry we started off on the Debbie Downer here. You've got some questions here that'll bring us back.

SPEAKER_06 22:59

Yeah. But when our when our last grandfather passed away back in 2019, you know, we're Lacey and I live down here in Florida, we're six hours away from everybody, all our all my family. And we got the phone call that morning, it was go, go, go. Yeah, had to get to my family as fast as possible. And bless her heart. Because I didn't eat, I was I probably went a good two days because I just didn't think about it. Yeah, I just didn't I had no interest in food.

SPEAKER_08 23:23

That was that was bad.

SPEAKER_06 23:24

Plus her heart. She got to Birmingham and finally said, I've got to have something. Yeah. And so I was like, I begged him.

SPEAKER_01 23:33

I was like, stop wherever you want, but you've got to eat something. And he was like, I can't. I can't. And I was like, Well, then go to Chick-fil-A because I can't.

SPEAKER_06 23:41

Like I'll tell you what, I can eat. I get what you're saying.

SPEAKER_08 23:48

There's there's something weird that's like uh so being so worried about everything else that you you just you know you'll take care of you whenever if if you get there, you know.

SPEAKER_02 24:00

You might not remember, but even after you weren't eating.

unknown 24:05

No.

SPEAKER_02 24:06

Because I remember that.

SPEAKER_08 24:07

Yeah, I I had a lot of trouble after that for a while. I had trouble sleeping and all that. Uh so anyway, well I'm glad we started off on such a high note here. All right, next question.

SPEAKER_01 24:22

Favorite him.

SPEAKER_08 24:24

Him.

SPEAKER_06 24:25

I think we can get who was it that was like, who's him?

SPEAKER_01 24:28

Who's him?

SPEAKER_06 24:29

Yeah, we asked the question one time.

SPEAKER_01 24:32

We asked my dad. Oh yeah. I said, Who's your favorite him? And he was like, Right now I'm kind of partial to Mark Harmon. Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_03 24:42

Are you scared of all the people he knows? Oh back in the battle. Mark Harmon.

SPEAKER_08 24:52

So who's your favorite hymn? He really is. He's hilarious. My favorite hymn? Or either one?

SPEAKER_02 24:59

I like the goodness of God right now, but this like changes. I like so many. Pick a lane man.

SPEAKER_08 25:05

Well, well, here's the thing. Goodness of God, are you familiar with Song? Maybe. Okay. Very new to us because we just started learning it two years ago at Exposure. Was it Exposure or was it It was either Exposure or CYC, which both of those are youth camps and conferences that we go to with the youth group. And it was Exposure has a singing class that they do each year. And I think it was more likely to be at that.

SPEAKER_02 25:38

So also like how can it be? And the only time I hear it, it's there.

SPEAKER_06 25:41

Yeah, yeah, yeah. How can it be? That one sounds familiar.

SPEAKER_01 25:46

Y'all want me to sing it?

SPEAKER_06 25:47

Sing it for us.

SPEAKER_01 25:49

But no, goodness of God, I love that. I love that. So so tell me what that means to you though.

SPEAKER_06 25:55

Like God is good.

SPEAKER_02 25:59

Well I I even have it on a shirt. All my life you have been faithful. All my life you have been so, so good.

SPEAKER_01 26:07

I have that t-shirt too. Did you get it at Pickers?

SPEAKER_02 26:12

No. I have a friend that that shirts, and I got it from from her. What is this? He's always faithful no matter what you're going through. He's always there.

SPEAKER_08 26:28

So I really like that song. Yeah, well, it's it's amazing how many new songs we've accumulated over the last few years. Because we'll we'll be with other youth groups or we'll be with at conferences and whatever camp or something, and we'll hear something, and she'll nudge me and be like, We got that one. I don't think so. I'm I'm Googling. And as many hymns as we have in our digital library, we ought to have them all by now, but we're still building.

SPEAKER_06 26:56

So that's one thing, and again, we will get to this eventually. But with your podcast too, which I think was part of that, you had a later episode of and of singing. And uh some of those songs, y'all had a lot of newer songs that sound like that that I hadn't heard yet on that. And that was kind of neat to hear.

SPEAKER_08 27:27

Oh yeah. Yeah, we have a very diverse group.

SPEAKER_06 27:29

I could hear Lorel leading and pushing the group through some areas.

SPEAKER_08 27:34

There's certain songs, and usually the newer songs, there's uh there's like a handful of us that will only attempt those, and I I I I understand why, because we're exposed to those more than the others or whatever. And we're more comfortable with them, so we'll lead those. We finally got you to do oceans. I know, yeah, but we can pull it off with our girls too, so we may have to do that before we leave. Uh well, not on here, but don't spoil a good notion. But there's certain songs that I will not lead unless Lorelai and then Libby Adcock or uh and then other certain people are there. Yeah, because I won't be able to we won't be able to get through certain sections of it.

SPEAKER_06 28:14

I can tell there were some songs that felt like Lorelai just hadn't had enough, and she's like, I'm driving this now. She does jump in.

SPEAKER_08 28:21

She yeah, she's very much jump in or get out of the way.

SPEAKER_06 28:24

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:25

Next time y'all's down with we can plan it right, we should do the youth group singing there. So that would be great.

SPEAKER_08 28:30

They love to sing, so that would be nothing to get that all together. That'd be good. We should do that. Yeah. So what was your mine was I'm old school.

SPEAKER_06 28:38

Did you Mark Harmon too?

SPEAKER_08 28:40

No, Mark Harmon didn't write this one actually. Be with me, Lord.

SPEAKER_06 28:47

That's an older one, right? Yeah, I know that.

SPEAKER_07 28:49

Be with me, Lord.

SPEAKER_08 28:50

I cannot live without thee. I cannot live without thee. That's a good one I dare not try to take one step alone. I cannot bear the loads of life unaided. I need thy strength to lean myself upon.

SPEAKER_05 29:03

You're a little flat, but I like that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 29:05

Yeah, I can't carry a tube in a bucket. But the verse that always gets me, even when I lead it, is be the fourth verse and the arrangement that I that we sing more traditionally, more typically, is Be with me, Lord, when loneliness or takes me, when I must weep amid the fires of pain, and when shall come the hour of my departure for worlds unknown, O Lord, be with me then. That one always That one always gets me.

SPEAKER_06 29:34

You have chosen wisely. Well, this is turning into just a get to know you episode. Uh you thought you knew us all. Yeah. And just to get to know you, we have you know go in some go in some deep places already, but Okay, I gotta ask this one. We've talked about it in past episodes just because we gotta know. Real quick, if you were to go into the future, um what am I missing? If you were to take if you could only take one.

SPEAKER_08 30:06

Dad's telling me. Are we splashed down?

SPEAKER_06 30:08

By the way, we're as of this recording, we're anticipating the Artemis capsule splashdown and our dad, who is heavily involved in that program is blowing us up. Yeah, he's not a genius, he's a rocket scientist, and so everybody's breathing a sigh of relief now that the Artemis 2 crew has landed. So, man, that could be another episode, by the way. But I know if you were real quick before we dive into the real stuff, if you were to go into the future, you don't know what the state of the world is, the culture, all that, but you can only take one book of the Bible with you. Which book would it be? Which team?

SPEAKER_08 30:46

I've heard y'all talk about this, and I'm battle lines. I'm afraid to answer because y'all are gonna pick us apart.

SPEAKER_06 30:51

It's important to pick the right team. So well, you go ahead.

SPEAKER_07 30:57

Dun dun dun. You go first.

SPEAKER_02 31:01

Don't be scared. No, she's kind of like, you know, this is one of those that I look at the question and I'm like, God's not gonna allow it to be like that. He's gonna let you take the whole thing. Anyway, Jamma's out.

SPEAKER_06 31:16

Oh Jonathan, which one?

unknown 31:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:18

I I love Dawn. So I'm just gonna say John.

SPEAKER_06 31:21

Team John, we have another one Taylor on board. Sorry, Team Mark, which is only Lacey right now. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 31:30

Well y'all, none of them none of y'all are gonna like me. Are you gonna pick your own team? Yeah. Hebrews.

SPEAKER_01 31:38

I like it. Nobody said Hebrews.

SPEAKER_08 31:40

Now I understand. I know I understand why y'all would pick individual gospels. Yeah. That makes sense. That's fine. That's fine. But Hebrews. I know. We have the faith hall of fame.

SPEAKER_06 31:50

We have all kinds of things that you need to know. I just need Hebrews 11, 1 through 6. Really. I don't need to. How about you need the whole Bible, son? How about that? That's what you need. You need to be able to do that. I don't get what you're saying. I get what you're saying. There's some it's chocolate.

SPEAKER_08 32:04

Hebrews has just as far as if I was only able to now, you know, we're saying the Bible is fully intact somewhere, but you're alone on an island and you only get to choose one. That would that make you feel better if it was put to you that way?

SPEAKER_02 32:18

Maybe. I would probably choose actually first John something like that. I love first John, second John, first.

SPEAKER_04 32:27

I just like the first book of Rayburn.

SPEAKER_08 32:34

No, that no, that's his first Rayburn's first letter. No, that's that's no, that's his, yeah. And then dad's second John. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 32:41

So our grandfather's John. That's the joke. So our our our grandfather's John, our dad's name, he's John Jr., and then Jonathan. Yeah, and John. Yeah, first, second, third John, and then your son Jude. What a revelation, right?

SPEAKER_08 32:56

Yeah, I'm not hanging around for revelation. Revelation Maxwell's gonna have to do his own thing.

SPEAKER_06 33:00

And then you got Benjamin over here treading water.

SPEAKER_03 33:05

I'm here too, guys. Is this a good activity? I got six at the sunstore. Are y'all gonna leave me at Walmart again?

SPEAKER_06 33:16

All right. So let's try this one more time. Oh man. All right, so well, let's uh so we wanna I'm curious to know, really. So you're we talked about your podcast. Leave it gather round table talks. Phenomenal podcast, by the way. You guys look it up. It's almost a pretty much interview platform. Yes, it is. And you have video, so you're better than us. And uh but you you went through, you interviewed your your children, you interviewed me, you interviewed Lacey, you interviewed Tom, your preacher, who you mentioned, and a bunch of other folks too. And primarily focused on prayer. Like what does prayer mean to you? You know, what are your b biggest takeaways of prayer? I and I'm kind of curious as far as what were some of your biggest takeaways from that, and and and I'd like to hear your what what prayer means to you as well, and how you would sum of that up.

SPEAKER_08 34:13

Well, as far as biggest takeaways go, you know, people are so different.

SPEAKER_07 34:21

You know, even in the sa in the same family, people are so different.

SPEAKER_08 34:28

And that being said, you know, if you have a whole room full of people that wanted to choose one flavor of ice cream, you're gonna get, you know, so many different answers. But when it comes to prayer, there was a lot of uh congruency, a lot of similarities in the samples that we got. Which makes sense because, you know, prayer, you know, you it there's not a lot of room for diversification there. Now, as far as habits, practices, and things like that, that honestly didn't uh didn't differentiate there wasn't a whole lot of differences in that. And it was really interesting to see you know, depending on the walks of life that people came from, like their careers, their up their upbringing, their their experience that they had had throughout life, how that played into their answers that they had for these questions that we had for prayer. That was the interesting thing to me. And then the experiment that I did with my kids.

SPEAKER_06 35:35

Which is great. Episode two, I believe. Uh two or three, or two. But if you can catch that one, it's great.

SPEAKER_08 35:40

I love the I need to go back and do it again now that we're more than there now now that we're a year removed from it.

SPEAKER_06 35:45

Your youngest Jude. Jude was our favorite answer.

SPEAKER_08 35:49

Uh what does prayer mean to you? What I what I did was ask them these questions, these five questions that I had been asking everyone else. And up into you know that I'd only been discussing this with youth group and with adults. So I was like, let's see what the six-year-old says. Let's see what the let's see, was she uh Lucy was 10, I think, at the time. Or 10 or 11. So the 10-year-old says, and the 12-year-old and the 14-year-old. And well no, Laura was 15, I think, by that point. But anyway, the older with a teenager town, and then all the way down to Jude, you know. And so it was Scooby-Doo and nachos. Scooby-doo and nachos. We're all thankful for different things.

SPEAKER_06 36:29

So Lacey said the same thing too, which is what we gotta kick out of. I like Scooby-Doo and nachos.

SPEAKER_08 36:36

Your answer was Scooby-Doo and nachos, that's right. But yeah, just the diversity the more things change, the more they say seem the same, you know. Yeah, it all came back to the same point. That was interesting.

SPEAKER_06 36:50

So as far as you and personally, because that's that's the thing on the episode on the podcast you're interviewing, you're doing you're doing most of the listening and asking questions. I know you kind of mentioned it a little bit, you know, but as far as your prayer practices, what does prayer mean to you? And then and even as a head of a household, as a father, as a as a husband, a leader in your family, as a man.

SPEAKER_08 37:19

Manly man.

SPEAKER_06 37:21

Wha wha how how how do you make prayer a priority, not just for you, but the family as a leader?

SPEAKER_08 37:28

Prayer personally is one of those things that is an individual's responsibility. Up until we started this whole the the the theme that we had last year of focusing on prayer. Up until that point, my prayer life was good, I would say. It wasn't terrible. It wasn't as bad as I had been in the past by any stretch. But as with anything, especially spiritually, there's always room for improvement. There's always room to do better. And I found ways to do better even during the last year, during uh 2025. Last year was 2025, wasn't it? Oh man. I know what you mean. I can't get myself everyone's going. But during 2025, I found ways to improve my prayer life, and a lot of it came from the answers and from the the answers and the uh the experience. Man, I couldn't come up with experience. Y'all didn't have coffee for me. I couldn't come up with experience. The experience that other people had had and had offered their answers. And I I rolled that into, hey, let me try this, you know? Yeah. And the biggest thing that I found that helped me out personally was to make a list, which you know you always hear that. You know, a prayer list. We have a prayer list at church, you have a prayer list like a prayer journal kind of thing. Uh well, I have it in my notes here. I have a whole thing, and I have it categorized, and I have it and I have it in numerical order, but it's not it doesn't mean anything. Uh, you know, so all of you at this table are on that prayer list. Well, actually, everyone in this house is on that prayer list.

SPEAKER_01 39:09

Even the dog?

SPEAKER_06 39:11

Especially the dog. Here you go.

SPEAKER_08 39:13

That's why I was trying to say I didn't want anyone to be disappointed when Indiana was up at number two and everyone else is under that.

SPEAKER_04 39:20

She should be shocked. I mean, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 39:22

She's pretty high on my list. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 39:25

Probably higher than our dogs.

SPEAKER_08 39:27

One of Oh, date. I don't know about yeah. Poor baby. I love her so much. I love you, dude. My poor dog. I'm gonna need that as a hotkey for my poor future episode. My poor dog, she okay. So we have two schnauzers. One is normal and one is not. They're sisters and they're from the same batch, but one was uh kind of a messed up runt. And she's no, listen, she had to have surgery because her guts were literally in her heart. Okay in her heart. Guts were in her chest cavity. And so they had this surgery, and so she looks like a sawed-off version of her sister. And she's sawed off is such a great example description. I mean, she does, and she has this underbite and this dumb look on her face all the time, and she's the most loving dog you've ever seen until you try to pick up the mover and that she'll bite you. I love you too.

SPEAKER_04 40:22

I love you too, daddy.

SPEAKER_08 40:23

She's got this underbite. She looks like uh Carl Childers, you know. And so I only hear that voice whenever she looks at me with that, you know, somebody cooking biscuits, that wide-eyed stare she's got. She looks at me and like, daddy, I wish you'd drop that cheese.

SPEAKER_02 40:39

She absolutely loves Jonathan, and it's so funny. Okay.

SPEAKER_08 40:42

I I I I'm indifferent to the dogs, okay. Pay for them. I love them because I have to, you know, but she will show up and she'll bring me a toilet, be like, Look, daddy, I got this for you. And I'm like, okay. She'll be waiting for me to come back out of the bathroom. You're doing it. And I'll look at you, you're still there. Yeah, daddy, because I love you. So I'm like, okay. All right. Well, um Yeah, the dog's prayer. Yeah. Sorry. I don't know how that happened. But yeah, I found all these ways to improve my personal prayer life. But as far as your question as to the importance of when you're a leader and when you're the head of your household, very important. We we do a lot of praying as a family, we do a lot of praying individually. I know uh it's it's it's interesting to watch these kids change over time with their prayer practices and everything.

SPEAKER_07 41:43

And yeah.

SPEAKER_08 41:45

As evidenced by that episode that we did with that experiment of you know, what does prayer mean to you and all that?

SPEAKER_06 41:50

Which is so amazing to hear open up like those.

SPEAKER_08 41:53

Yeah. Because you have Scooby doing nachos, and then you move up five years to Lucy, and she gives the answer she gives, and then two more years to Lizzie, and then two more years to Lorelai, where you get the big, you know, profound answers from her.

SPEAKER_06 42:08

Stole a lot of mine, my answers.

SPEAKER_08 42:10

I know, right? But and that was a very uh empowering and uh encouraging moment to hear, especially. I mean, I expected what I got out of the six-year-old, let's be honest, it was gonna be comical and entertaining. I knew that was gonna happen. But uh to hear uh my daughters uh speak of prayer and what it means to them, and I'm like you're 10 or 11, and you're 13 and you're 15. And wow, okay, wow, that's great. You were listening, and not just to me, but you were listening to your teachers, you were listening to the preacher, you were listening to your grandparents, they're thinking on their own. There's yeah, yeah, just that level. It was just phenomenal.

SPEAKER_06 42:56

Well, uh Anna, I know I've been focused on Jonathan and Jade here.

SPEAKER_08 43:01

I love mama too.

SPEAKER_06 43:02

But you were heavily involved in this podcast too. You're in several episodes.

SPEAKER_08 43:07

I think you're most of them.

SPEAKER_06 43:08

Did you were there some big profound takeaways for you or or things that you've learned or or things that you haven't got to share yet about prayer?

SPEAKER_02 43:16

It was interesting seeing everyone's what they would choose as their favorite prayer.

SPEAKER_06 43:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:23

Most people would have the same answer, you know, yeah, just about on what prayer means to you, you know. Yeah, when it's like when there's nothing else you can do, but yet it's the greatest thing you could do. So having that avenue of prayer.

SPEAKER_01 43:38

Well, Anna, I want to ask you, mom to mom, how do you make prayer a priority? Like when do you find like your little nuggets of time throughout the day to pray when you have, you know, Mom, I want to snack, mom, where are my shoes, mom, mom? So I was not always good at this.

SPEAKER_02 44:04

I mean there's times where you're up and it's like you then you just feel like your head hits the pillow at night and you're like, oh no, what did I do? You know, yeah, have it slowed down because sometimes it's like that, but I try to do little prayers all throughout the day. Just when I'm thinking of something, I just pray for it right there, even if it's small. And I do have a list in my phone where I try to focus on the big bigger one at least once a day, you know. But it's not always easy, but that's why I try to do it, you know, just a little at a time. Was the best way I could do it.

SPEAKER_06 44:47

So that kind of leads us into our next topic here, getting into marriage and parenting. You know, kind of going off that a little bit as you know, as a mother and uh and Jonathan. How do you prioritize your marriage with so much going on like you're talking about? Or do you you do what you can when you can.

SPEAKER_02 45:15

We weren't always good at this. It took us a while to figure that one out.

SPEAKER_08 45:20

Actually, it was yeah, it was kind of difficult for us to finally get to a good balance. You know, we still wish we could balance more uh towards more time with each other alone, but when you you have four kids and then you have extra kids like we do with the youth group, someone's always texting, someone's always needing something, something was someone's always needing you to work on something. And uh you still gotta just find that time, whether you gotta beat it out of your schedule mercilessly or whatever, to be together and work on each other. That's why we finally got to getting away from everything for a little while every once in a while. Just that helps.

SPEAKER_02 46:07

Listening and realizing what do what? Listening. Are you not listening? Just really I'm sorry, what just realizing w how your partner wants to be loved and then how you want to be loved, it's not always the same.

SPEAKER_08 46:27

And then ignoring it and railroading right through it.

SPEAKER_02 46:29

Yeah. Thank you. But then I guess that's what took us a long time to figure out.

unknown 46:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 46:36

And so once we did, and we just slowed down for a minute and listened to each other and what we both needed and putting each other first.

SPEAKER_01 46:47

Uh I'm just kind of curious, what are y'all's love languages?

SPEAKER_08 46:52

Hers or acts of quality, words of service. Words of affirmation. Yeah. Yeah. That's one of the things.

SPEAKER_02 47:03

Are you telling her what you don't know yourself?

SPEAKER_08 47:07

Yeah, I I mean, yeah, definitely. But I know what works. I thank you. Words of affirmation are very big for you. Oh, as far as oh, you're talking about as far as what our low as what we do for not what works on the spouse.

SPEAKER_01 47:26

No, like what mine would be.

SPEAKER_08 47:28

Oh, I got that backwards. Sorry.

SPEAKER_01 47:29

Yes.

SPEAKER_08 47:30

My bad. So Anna, what would you say yours is? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:33

Quality time. Yeah, no, number one.

SPEAKER_08 47:35

Definitely. Yeah, sorry, my bad.

SPEAKER_02 47:37

Access service number two. Yeah. Definitely.

SPEAKER_08 47:40

And as far as what works though. That's actually a good point. Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:48

Jonathan.

SPEAKER_08 47:50

What was mine? I'm trying to remember. Uh I think it was like physical touch and words of affirmation. Those were your two highs for you. Gift giving and what I know that's the two highs for you. Yeah. Yeah, but I'm a dude. Is that a Maxwell thing? No, that's it.

SPEAKER_01 48:05

I guess it's a Maxwell thing because he's the same thing. It it is, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 48:09

But oh, go ahead.

SPEAKER_06 48:11

No, no, no. Just kind of speaking of because I don't know if this is a guy thing or if y'all relate to this as well. But one thing, as far as when it comes to marriage, one of the things I've noticed that I've had to that I'm still working on is like when you're at work and you get very task oriented and get you me for me, I have to get narrowly mind. I have to get narrowly focused on I gotta get this done, then I'm gonna get this done, then I'm gonna get this done. And I get so zeroed in. But then when you make that transition from home, that doesn't, I mean from work, that doesn't work at home. Like when I get home, I need to be more go with the flow. I need to be more present-minded. Is that something that that you maybe Anna that you struggle with see the face she's making?

SPEAKER_02 48:58

Yeah. So he will yeah, he can walk in the door, you can tell he's tired, and I'm ready. I'm gonna jump and I'm gonna think, I love you, I missed you, I'm gonna hug it.

SPEAKER_03 49:08

And she bounces off me like a ping pong ball off a battleship.

SPEAKER_08 49:11

And I mean, I'm like, I'm not ready yet.

SPEAKER_06 49:16

I'm trying, I'll get there eventually. Usually it's after we eat dinner. One of the things I struggle with, I don't really have a commute. I'm you know, I work just down the road from where we live, so I don't have a lot of decompress time, but I've been very fortunate. She's that Lacey's picked up on that. And and one thing we kind of have a fish, like kind of an agreement that she'll tell me all about her day. I don't want to relive my day. Yeah, and she won't push me on it. And and I think it works, but she still gives me a little time to decompress and and make that transition. I'm I feel like I'm starting to get a little may maybe a little better making that shift and to be more present in the moment, and especially with a daughter now and and all of that. I didn't know if that was something too that you've had to navigate.

SPEAKER_01 49:59

It was a big struggle for me when Gabby was first born, and I was like, I was home all the time. And he would come home and I would tell me about your day.

SPEAKER_00 50:10

Yeah, what's it like on the outside?

SPEAKER_01 50:11

Yes, and I would I know you don't like office drama, but I need you to talk about office drama. Like I need you to talk to me about creating drama just to have something to bring home.

SPEAKER_08 50:22

That sounds like the plot on the soap opera I'm gonna watch today.

SPEAKER_01 50:25

Are you making this but but yeah, because that that's a thing, and you know, because it's like what is going on in the outside world? Talk to me about literally anything.

SPEAKER_06 50:36

I watched a really good blue episode, yeah. Yeah, I watched a really good blue episode.

SPEAKER_02 50:40

I think Jonathan's learned that too. Yeah, that I don't care if it was boring. Talk to me. Just talk to me.

SPEAKER_04 50:48

What did you put in your coffee?

SPEAKER_03 50:50

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 50:51

I'm like, please explain to me every single detail about your dad's rocket. Exactly. Like, literally.

SPEAKER_08 50:58

Get him on the phone. Yeah, just call him. He'll tell you what. That's the one thing he'll talk about.

SPEAKER_06 51:03

And it'll be in acronyms the whole thing. Yes, I mean DL up plugged into the R A T or whatever shot the L H.

SPEAKER_08 51:09

I am sat stuck in my L Fab. Nothing went T O L.

SPEAKER_06 51:15

Side note, he's making up majority of those. He's got to be.

SPEAKER_08 51:19

He's really not, actually. Uh I I follow on a lot more than I used to now. I can work on stuff. But yeah. It's it's a lot of it's legit more legit than we want it to be. But so the best way I ever heard put heard this put was especially with like the kind of roles that me and Ben have at work, you deal with the public all day, you deal with coworkers every day, you would deal with other adults all day, which they can act like children too, but you're actually act interacting with adults. You especially are in this stage right now with Gabby being so young. Anna's yeah, old we've got older kids now that you can have a conversation with and get through some things. So I think that I think that aspect's a little easier now. But the best way of her put was you spent all day talking to adults, and you come home to someone who spent all day talking to children who needs to talk to adults, and you're spent on talking to adults. And so it's it's a hard, you know.

SPEAKER_06 52:25

I don't know. I feel like you're using the adult word. There's there's some conversations I have at work where I miss talking to a three-year-old.

SPEAKER_08 52:32

I know. Sometimes I was like, is your child at home?

SPEAKER_06 52:35

Can you put them on the is there a is there a two-year-old in the house I can speak to?

SPEAKER_08 52:39

I need to reason with someone who is, you know, gonna be rational here, like an unstable three-year-old that with a handful of goldfish. That'd be great. But yeah, so you're basically have one person who's emptied their cup of conversation with adults, and you're coming towards someone who needs it to be emptied into because there's, you know, they haven't had any in it all day.

SPEAKER_06 53:05

And uh that kind of goes with the Enneagram, which we'll probably have to do an episode on. Miss Enneagram over here, my wife. She's made us all. She's I was very skeptical of it, but the more I read into it, we've I've kind of we've kind of pegged me at either a four or a five. I think I'm more of a four. But that's one thing about a four. I don't I don't know what you if you guys looked into or what you are, but you have we call it my my energy quota or no, my my social quota. And it's like once I'm spent, I'm done. I I can't small talk, I can't put put on the smile anymore. Like I'm spent, and that's kind of how it kind of what you're describing. My social battery, yeah. What you're talking about. So yeah, I'll come home, my social battery's out, and hers is fully charged with it and I go.

SPEAKER_01 53:51

Well, and and it's funny because like we'll go to dinner with some friends, and when we leave, I'm like happy. I am filled up, my my cup is full, my cup is running over. I am so excited and I'm so happy he's done. Yeah, he doesn't want to talk, he is done for the next month. So I'm like, okay, all right. This is why we have no friends, by the way.

SPEAKER_06 54:15

And she's the only reason we have friends.

SPEAKER_01 54:19

So but but just trying to learn each other's love languages and learning what fills each other's that's the tricky part. Yeah, especially when you're so different.

SPEAKER_08 54:33

Right. Well, and it's like uh I think we were discussing this earlier about how opposites attract and how you know those the the diversity and the uh personalities, yeah, why it works so well because you know, me and Anna can't agree on watching anything on TV or a movie.

SPEAKER_06 54:56

So and but you know we we kind of and I I mentioned this I think a little earlier as far as like you know, I worry about how much I'm rubbing off on her. I need her to rub off on me, not that I need to rub off on her because I'm running with a sledgehammer.

SPEAKER_08 55:10

Listen, I mentioned that earlier too. I mentioned that she is rubbing off on you. I told her earlier that she was making you into a decent human being, and we think too far. Yeah, I said decent, I didn't say great.

SPEAKER_06 55:22

But it's like I've come from a very like and we're about to get into the spiritual connection too. Even spiritually, like I'm I'm more skeptical. I'm more I'll dig in a little deeper. I don't take things on face value as much. I'm not saying like where she is more grace, I would she'll call it gullible. I I call it grace. I I think I'm more of a you know, I'll get into the the weeds and and really and and like my flags will go up quicker when I start seeing. Yeah, skeptical is probably the best way to put it. But I I she'll call it gullible. I call it she's more grace-minded as far as giving grace, extending grace, and and that's one thing I admire about her that I and that I've noticed by seeing it in her and and that she's more grace-giving, but also genuine about it, that it's that I want that to rub off on me because genuine and authenticity authenticity is big things for me. And and that's you know, those opposites where it's like I see what she has that I lack, and it's I need it, but I see her getting more skeptical and I get scared, like, oh no. And then it works. I hear her I I don't know if you deal with this where you hear your John Maxwell or dad come out, yeah. I it bothers me, and I I try so hard to contain it. When I start hearing it come out of her, it's it's when I really get concerned. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_08 56:48

I haven't had that trouble with no. No, no, she Anna's nope. Are you afraid to talk? Yeah, they're like, no, I am actually. If y'all and what what what your listeners don't know is the dynamic between Anna and our our dad, and it's uh so much fun to watch because when Anna came into the family. Okay, there were things you don't do around our dad. You don't eat off his plate, you don't interrupt him, you don't do this, you don't do that, and you sure don't put the dog in his face.

SPEAKER_02 57:26

His grandpuppy.

SPEAKER_08 57:28

And Anna broke every one of those with Anna's the one that could break all of them. Yeah, within the first year of our marriage, she snatched food off of his plate at least once. When did that happen? It was amazing.

SPEAKER_02 57:41

I know y'all, I didn't even know it was a thing. I didn't realize it until a lot later when y'all finally told me.

SPEAKER_08 57:48

Oh no, that changes everything. I don't know why we didn't tell. We didn't think anyone had the option to do it. And there you are. And then, but the time that she brought the dog over and put Ivy right up in his face and said, Here's your grandpuppy, and the face that he made is like you ate a handful of warheads, licked the lemon, doused yourself with lime juice, and then ate a grapefruit.

SPEAKER_02 58:15

It was I didn't notice that either.

SPEAKER_06 58:17

Oh man. And I've always respected you, especially for Mary and Jonathan, but now wow. It was beautiful. Teach me your way. It was beautiful.

SPEAKER_08 58:26

And you know what? He couldn't react. I'm sitting back and I and I'm I'm I'm just scared to death. I'm over here shaking a little bit. I'm like, oh, what's he gonna say to my wife here? And he's just gritting his teeth and going, Oh nice, doggy. Well, and I'm like, he didn't explode. What in the world? Well, there's the father-daughter aspect to it too, because you and I, we oh yeah, we still think bludgeons to death. There's still things our sister knows not to do and knows not to get away with. But she could get away with it, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 58:54

But Hannah did it, and we were like, What?

SPEAKER_08 58:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 59:00

Well was there anything else? I I I wanted to kind of dig in a little spiritually too, as far as marriage goes. Um, you know, ways that you guys we've talked about ways, you know, transitioning from work to home, some more of the surface level, but digging down a little deeper, ways that you guys have maybe been a little more intentional spiritually or anything like that as as far as your marriage goes.

SPEAKER_07 59:26

Did you want to go first? Yeah. Sorry.

SPEAKER_08 59:30

Um, so we have focused a lot more on that very thing for the last three or four years or so, especially. Some of the spiritual connection that we have was just kind of trial by fire, and it was forged abruptly and kind of all at once from the trials we went through. You either stay together and get together close and hold on to each other, or you you get separated. Right. You know, and you see that happen sometimes when traumatic things happen in a especially a young family that can never reconcile or like when your wife holds a dog up to your dad.

SPEAKER_06 1:00:13

Yeah, yeah. That kind of truth.

SPEAKER_08 1:00:14

Here's your grandpuppy. But so some of that was that but much later, like and and seriously within like about the last three to four years, we really and uh I think a lot of it has to do with dealing with the youth group too, because we study pretty regularly with each other. We swap notes on things, we teach classes. Uh we'll have instances where Anna takes the girls to teach a class, and I'll take the guys, and we have same or similar material and we go over it and sometimes we write it for each other and you know that kind of thing. But we went to a marriage conference was it three years ago? Close to three years ago now. Two or three, I don't remember. In Meridianville, at the Meridianville Church of Christ, north of Huntsville, and uh they had a couple there, Trey and Lee. I don't know if you've ever heard them, they're out of Texas.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:16

Maybe because we did one, I think, last year, year before.

SPEAKER_08 1:01:20

Yeah. I can't remember if it was so they they have a podcast and everything. Maybe it wasn't pretty big. I wasn't too bundled the woman.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:28

Yeah. Maybe you should have listened to it. Well, when you go in and say marriage is literally the easiest thing I've ever done, you don't really know. I think you're lying. They didn't pick up on my jokes. No, no, no.

SPEAKER_08 1:01:42

But no, this is but no, they uh they were excellent, and if you get a chance, I definitely uh suggest listening to the them. What was their names again? Trey and Lee. Okay. L E A. It looks like Leah, but it's uh she they pronounced it Lee, her name. But they uh they had all of this great presentation and everything, and they laid some stuff out. They went through some stuff and I was like, yeah, I know this makes sense. And then they were like, you know what? And then when they lay it out for you, you're like, I guess I could work on that a little bit better. I could do this a little bit better. But yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:02:21

It's that whole identifying the stuff you you don't know, you don't know.

SPEAKER_08 1:02:25

Well it's like the prayer list thing when it comes down to it, what once you put it on paper or a list, a physical tangible list, it gets really real to you a little more. So but I remember when Anna said, Hey, because I didn't know anything about Train Lee at that time, and uh just hey, I've been listening to this couple and they're great, and they're doing this marriage conference at Meridianville, and we have friends at Meridianville. And it's like, yeah, I'll go just to see if someone I know is there and all that stuff. And and it I ended up enjoying it despite my best efforts. Yeah, so I told you. And I got a and I and I got a lot of good teaching from it because he's that both of them have been married for uh a while longer than us. They have all grown children, all boys, I believe. That's right. Uh he's a preacher and I think he's an elder two now. I might be overstepping, I'm not sure anyway. But uh but uh they uh it it ended up being just a great time. And they and I started listening to more stuff and following some of the stuff because he does some great leadership stuff too.

SPEAKER_06 1:03:36

That seems to be the case. Any any what whatever it is, when you're trying to make anything and be more intentional, prioritize anything, you know, whether it's recovering from a you know a hardship or you're gonna be more you want to be more intentional about spiritual matters with your wife or something like that. It always seems like it's that initial step. How do you go about that initial step that it's always the the toughest part? Yeah. Because you at least from my standpoint, probably yours it's that whole it requires a little bit of a vulnerability, which is the hardest part for me. Yeah. It's humbling and vulnerable in nature.

SPEAKER_08 1:04:13

Yeah, because we're you know, and it's not our parents' fault by any stretch, it was society at the time when we were growing up. You are you don't cry, you don't show any emotion, you don't you internalize these things. Yeah. And that was one of the very things that nearly killed our grandfather at a younger age. He had ulcers really bad, and we had internalized so much that he had some real issues, health issues. And so he would actually talk to me, and I don't know if you got this speech from him or not, because this was one of those one-on-one speeches. I remember what he said to all of us all the time, but this is one of those one-on-one speeches because he would see as a young man how I would react to things and how I would do things. He said, You need to talk to somebody about that, or you need to not he said, Don't keep that to yourself, yeah. Because that will that could hurt you. You talk about it.

SPEAKER_06 1:05:06

So one thing that he said to me real late that impacted me, and it was about a particular subject, which I won't get into right now. Uh, we're getting short on time, but just the fact that he acknowledged he kind of where you're talking about, I got those where it's like you need to do this thing. Yeah, where there was a moment where he opened up and was, you know, and I was telling about some stuff I've heard from other men of his generation that kind of bothered me. And he's like, Well, that's how we were raised and grew up. But then he looked at me and said, But I'll tell you, I was wrong on that. And hearing him kind of be vulnerable in that situation. Yeah, the honesty and the fact that even that late in his life still changing and and growing was one of the most pivotal moments for me. But Anna, spiritually, any intentional as a daily intentional battle to deal with this one.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:01

Well you said the youth group and everything. We've always been very we try to be intentional about attending all the service, you know. We try to be very involved in church and everything. And doing the youth group added a lot of spiritual spiritual customers, and I think it's brought us closer. Yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_08 1:06:28

And of course, you know and one of the one of the things and and this was something we always had going for us was you know, we're at church, we sit by each other, we hear I love hearing her saying her little angelic voice up under my left arm over here. Uh because there's a lot of his wife, nothing. There's a little bit of height difference, so but I always hear her and and what was so what would mess me up bad was when we had each child, she would be at a commission for a little while, and so it'd be like a month or two. And I'd be sitting in the pew by myself singing, which I love to sing, and I'm gonna sing regardless, but not having her voice there, yeah, which is kind of you know I I can hear her good. She's not singing so loud that she's knocking the songbooks off the pew in front of us, but but she's singing louder. Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:28

Exactly, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:07:30

So she she's singing an you know, and it's kind of my rudder, kind of as far as my pitch and my uh and how we're where we're going with the song and how what but I I you know when she wouldn't be when she wasn't there because she was out with babies I was just kind of lost. I was just like singing, but I didn't feel I mean my heart was in the right place and I was worshiping. Don't get me wrong. Right. It's just uh I knew something was missing. Something was off. And yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:58

So No, I know what you mean there. The first few times after we got married, the first there was only there's only been like two, maybe three times I've ever had to go to church without her because she was sick or something, but whenever that happened, it was just one, she's my social buffer. Yeah. Like I said, she's the reason we have friends and people speak to us. But yeah, something's just yeah, when you get into that, I I hate to call it routine, but it is kind of a routine, but it's like it's it's more than that, it's a it's a rock, uh a foundation of of who you are.

SPEAKER_08 1:08:31

Well, you go to the doctor regularly, that's the you know same idea.

SPEAKER_06 1:08:37

Well, uh we're gonna have to we're gonna start wrapping this episode up. Luckily, we got you guys for a weekend, so they're done here visiting with us. So we're gonna I still have a lot, especially talking about youth group and church and everything. I wanna hopefully get one more episode with you guys and talk about that. But before we uh wrap this one up, was there something else that you wanted to ask about the marriage?

SPEAKER_01 1:09:00

No. Sorry, I was just gonna make a comment that all the kids are about to eat us. So we might we might need to wrap it up.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:11

Well, I'll I'll wrap this one up here as far as any advice that you would give your younger self in your first year or early in your marriage. Maybe don't hold the puppy up to dad.

SPEAKER_08 1:09:23

Don't wave the puppy in front of your father-in-law.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:28

Oh, we didn't know it was coming after our first anniversary, so I guess I would just be like just stay strong, you know. And I would be pushing the listening and learning each other more or sooner than we did, for sure.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:47

Well you say pushing the listening. Oh, you're like you would go back to your younger self. Yeah, be more intentional. I got you.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:54

If you'd listen.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:57

Obviously, I've not learned anything in our years of marriage. She just dunked on you, Hoss.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:02

Well, I mean, we we've always I think we've always had a strong marriage. We've never we've never wanna leave each other or anything, but we we did struggle through some things. Yeah. And it's all revolved around not being intentional with what each other needed.

SPEAKER_07 1:10:18

Yeah. Yeah. Interesting.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:19

It took us forever to figure that out, but we finally did.

SPEAKER_08 1:10:22

It it yeah. I mean it's not just some kind of clever platitude or something you have on a picture on the wall. Communication is very vital in everything in life, but especially in marriage. It's important in your job, it's impair important when you are gonna be any kind of leader, when you're going to be in a position where you expect others to people can only do if you want someone to do something, they gotta know from you what you want them to do. Super important for that to happen in a marriage. That's such a trying to pretend like you can read each other's minds.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:03

It doesn't work.

SPEAKER_08 1:11:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:11:04

It's eliminating that expectation that they should know. I still struggle with that today of well, by now she should know this. But it's like it's not a it's not a dig on her. It's a dig on me. Choose your next words wisely. And and changing my expectations and uh entitlement. It really is. Exactly.

SPEAKER_08 1:11:26

And that's kind of what I was gonna go towards is be more humble. Don't just, you know, assume that you know both of you are still growing and both of you are still learning, and you're not gonna know everything.

SPEAKER_07 1:11:41

But you know, regardless, at the end of the day, just love her, take care of her. And you know, that's just that's what it's all about.

SPEAKER_08 1:11:54

And communicate with her. She more often than not in relationships, the wife needs that communication more than the husband. Sometimes it's the opposite. It depends on the personality, definitely, but the wife needs that communication, even if you think it's redundant, even if you think it's silly, even if you, you know, come home from work and you're drained and she needs that communication, whether you like it or not. Yeah. So and that and and and feeding that need will help with growth tremendously.

SPEAKER_06 1:12:33

It's like when you're at work and you you ha you have to give that to customers, to uh co-workers. You have to g give that to yourself. You can't forget that you uh just m even more importantly, you have to give to your wife too. You have to give you know, you it's so easy to prioritize that work, you know, dynamic over the the home dynamic sometimes.

SPEAKER_08 1:12:57

And then you re then you forget that the most important work that you should be doing is working on your families.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:04

That happy, healthy marriage affects everything. Yeah, it imp like when when we finally, I think, s got in sync and figured everything about it it figured everything out. It would just made the everything else go smoother. Oh yeah, absolutely. Life with the kids. Um I don't know if your work was any smoother or not, but it just it just helped that I don't think there's any magic for that, but I r I read somewhere once that unmet expectations are the biggest marriage killer, and I think that that's probably true.

SPEAKER_06 1:13:39

Yes. Well to your last point too, I think that for for us or for me, there is something to that. When when I feel that when I feel secure in our relationship, it affects or whether I feel secure or not in our relationship affects my work life and even how I interact with people at church or wherever.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:58

Yes.

SPEAKER_06 1:13:58

And but that's one thing I've been extremely blessed with is having uh you know, there's been very rare times where I it's never felt secure. Right. And that we're on the same page, even if we disagree on something or whatever, it's been very minor and and whatever, but having that security, and when even that security isn't in jeopardy, but it feels a little, you know, off kilter a little bit, that you know, that's something that can really affect everything else.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:28

Well, one of my biggest blessings uh with being married to you is we decided before we got married that we will stay married. There is no out there. We we don't even we agreed to never even joke about the word divorce. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:14:50

It's just thrown around so flippantly now. It's ridiculous.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:53

Yeah, we've always known that was never an option.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:55

That's just not even there there's something so and I always knew she'd kill me first anyway. So it's true, it's true, and the fact that you're still here just speaks a lot to Anna. But but but knowing, you know, it it like our in, you know, our worst fights. Divorce is not even on the table. Knowing that just makes me feel so safe and so secure in that, and I am so grateful for that.

SPEAKER_06 1:15:25

And it keeps fights from escalating, because you when you think about, you know, you you have those things that you throw out to kind of leverage or to negotiate for lack of a better word, but those are non-negotiable things that we've taken off the table that keeps fights arguments, the few that we've ever had keeps those from growing worse. Well, we're on the same page on that.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:49

You're gonna work through it, you're gonna fight through it no matter what.

SPEAKER_06 1:15:52

Yeah, exactly. And and kind of a different as far as our marriage goes, a little different dynamic. Remember Mike Billingsley growing up as a kid? I think it was his dad that would come and preach, and and I I got close to Mike and and he was telling me, and this was when I was like maybe 14, 15, but advice I got from him because him and his wife, Geneva, they had moved away from their family. And he said that's one of the that's been a a crucial thing to our marriage, is that we're away from both of our families. And so if we ever get in a fight, there's no running away. You're you're here, you have to face it, and that's something that we've had. Not like we've ever had a fight that's ever gotten that that that way, but it's like we're three hours from her family, six hours from my family. So it's like if there's a we're we are here for each other, there's no retreating anywhere. We're we're in this together, no matter what. We're not really kind of like our only real allies, in a way, and that can work for some people, you know. I think.

SPEAKER_08 1:16:53

Well, that is a two-edged sword. Yeah, because we live that's where the dynamics are. We live 10 and 15 minutes apart from both from my folks and from her folks. And so if we ever did get in a fight, if she ran to her folks, I'm in trouble.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:11

She ran to your fault.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:12

If she ran to my folks, I'm in bigger trouble.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:14

That dynamic's the same with us.

SPEAKER_06 1:17:16

Yeah, I got threatened by her family. Like you hurt before we got married. If you hurt her, you will you we will kill you. My family said the same thing. You hurt her, we will kill you.

SPEAKER_08 1:17:24

So so she has two places wrong. I can't know where it's not. I've got shame.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:28

I got that's not having nothing shame.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:30

I don't have nothing.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:32

I said, and if I had to call cookie, oh y'all are dead. Y'all are dead if you have to call your sister.

SPEAKER_08 1:17:39

Y'all just go ahead and cremate me up.

SPEAKER_06 1:17:41

Yeah, don't don't let cookie get a hold of me, please.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:45

Just kill me. Never had to do that. We've made it. Just real quick, real quick. When when you asked my dad Oh man, oh just real fast.

SPEAKER_06 1:17:54

What you want to tell the story?

SPEAKER_01 1:17:56

Yes.

SPEAKER_06 1:17:56

Uh it's it's a mess, and I cringe just thinking about it. Because I had it all prepared in my mind. I was gonna go, you know, and uh before I ever proposed, I was gonna go to her dad and and talk to him, and and but it was the most stressful, anxiety-filled time of my life because I could never get a moment alone with him. Because it was either her or her mom or were right there, and I finally they were doing something, and I finally and I had it all worked out in my mind of what I was gonna say and how I was gonna say it, and I finally get him, and you know, it's like, can I have a word with you for a minute? And uh, and I finally just had to make the moment happen, like pull him aside. So he already knows something's up, and it came out just a blubber and mess. And I've you know and uh I love your daughter, and bless his heart. Speaking of Mr. Allen, you talked about earlier, he's heart of goal. The man knows he's punched anyone more understanding of that situation. He's like, he we we can joke about it, thankfully, now because he it's almost like he didn't have the heart to give me a hard time about it. He gave me the he gave me his blessing and all that. Then and we were in Laverne for the weekend or something, and I think it was the next day he and I were outside and and and talking. He's like, you know, I didn't really have the heart to tell you this yesterday, but I will say it now. If you ever hurt her, I will kill you, huh? I wouldn't expect anything less, sir.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:21

But he told me he's like, get in line.

SPEAKER_08 1:19:25

He didn't have the heart to tell you that while you were quivering and scale.

SPEAKER_06 1:19:28

I was like, that just speaks to just the golden heart, but I I still cringe thinking about it. Like, man, I butchered that moment. And but he still gave me the thumbs up, so I don't know. Anyway, we'll uh we gotta feed some youngins before we get in trouble. But I do there's a lot, a couple more topics, especially I I do want to pick y'all's brains on and and hear what you what you guys have to say about it and all that. But um, luckily we got you here for a little while, so we'll we'll get the most out of you. But we really appreciate everybody listening in. Again, shout out to our our Virginia family now and our Vietnamese family. We appreciate it. But let us know, guys, who you are. Uh we would love to hear from our listeners. Let us know. Uh send us your comments, your questions. Even if you have questions that you know you don't we don't necessarily have to speak about on the air. Hey Indy, Indy's getting his sugar. He's been under he but yeah, even if you have questions, uh if you have questions and comments that we you'd like for us to discuss on the air, we will. If you just have genuine questions that you really need answers to, um send them to us, and uh, you know, we'll if it's private, we'll we'll we'll communicate privately if you need to. So but anyway, we really appreciate you guys uh listening. Please like, uh rate, share our podcast with somebody. And um until next time, uh thanks for sticking around and being part of this moment.